Re: The D Programming Language

From:
"Peter Dimov" <pdimov@gmail.com>
Newsgroups:
comp.lang.c++.moderated
Date:
4 Dec 2006 15:24:38 -0500
Message-ID:
<1165243117.484437.230730@80g2000cwy.googlegroups.com>
Andrei Alexandrescu (See Website For Email) wrote:

David Abrahams wrote:

"Andrei Alexandrescu (See Website For Email)"


[...]

So my answer to "Purify can't tell you..." is "Because you don't
need Purify".


Of course not. That's a cute comeback but misses the point entirely.
In a GC'd system Purify is the wrong tool because there are no invalid
pointers. Instead you need a tool that tells you that something has
been kept alive too long, and nobody's figured out a tool to do that
because it's effectively impossible for a tool to tell what "too long"
is.


Ehm. I thought we were talking about arbitrary memory overwrites. Maybe
I did miss the point entirely.


Dave's point, to which I also subscribe, is that when nothing in a
programming language is illegal, you have no "legal standing" to
declare a program incorrect. So you can't have a tool like Purify that
automatically identifies that a program has performed an illegal
operation, because there are no illegal operations whatsoever.

It is certainly true that illegal operations that manifest themselves
as changing valid object memory at a random location are an incredible
pain to debug. On a practical level, this cannot be denied. On a
theoretical level, there is nothing in the C++ specification that
mandates that undefined behavior must be left undetected; in principle,
this allows a C++ implementation to be safer than Java. (In practice,
this never happens, because there is (was?) no market demand for it.
Hardware architectures that dutifully crashed your program on every
invalid pointer operation are now extinct.)

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